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Messages - fohdeesha

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16
So I went ahead and tried some meters and a basic label reading a float register and I couldn't get it to work. Was this introduced in 3.80? I'm still on 3.70

I put for instance F428681 in the plcaddressvalue field, but when I launch the app it states that is an invalid address

Maybe I'm doing something wrong, not sure! can't complain too much as reading integers and adding a decimal point works great

17
Open Discussion / Re: Controlling USB Relays via AdvancedHMI?
« on: November 06, 2014, 07:01:14 AM »
Trust me, if I can figure out basic use of ladder logic/plc programming then anyone can. Especially if you have coding/programming experience. After a youtube video or two it will make sense enough to do simple stuff (simple on/off type things, timers etc). When worse comes to worse and you want to do something weird like turning a momentary switch into a toggle, averaging analog values etc, you can just google it and you'll get 100 different examples you can copy.

In advancedHMI you can just drag and drop buttons to turn off different groups or outputs and display boxes for timer values etc and then just type in the plc addresses for all of them without writing a single line of code, I have no VB experience at all and I have a pretty full advancedhmi screen going with quite a bit of indications and temperature and timer displays. The stuff like grouping different relays and adding timers you would all do in the ladder logic on the plc

Feel free ask for help later on hopefully I or someone else can help out

18
Err yeah I meant an F heh. That's great news, I'll have to try it out once I get a new v3.80 project going

19
If you are reading a double integer, precede the address with an L , so you would use L47198

If it is a float, then precede it with an F

wait, does the modbusRTU driver now properly read and display float values and all we have to do is prepend an L? this changes everything! I have a lot of ladder logic converting float into integer values with an implied decimal just for HMI display I can clean up now :)

20
Open Discussion / Re: Controlling USB Relays via AdvancedHMI?
« on: November 05, 2014, 10:07:55 AM »
yeah I didn't mean automatic redundant control with multiple CPU's controlling the same set of cards, I meant that you can simply connect multiple click PLC's (and even PLC's from different manufacturers, different devices etc, if they support modbus RTU) so they can talk to each other and all be addressed and controlled either by each other or your HMI software like advancedHMI.

If you already have all the 120v wiring home ran and in one place than the built in AC relay cards can work well, just be sure ot note their max amperage and be sure you're under it (ovens draw a LOT of power and the AC cards are really only designed to switch low amperage things like lighting or large relays/contactors)

The software you were looking at for the click is simple ladder logic, that's how 99% of PLC's and industrial automation/control is programmed. It looks kind of goofy but makes sense pretty quickly. You can keep it simple and just interface advancedhmi directly to the output bits, or program in some logic on the plc so it can do things on it's own like shut off safety outputs if it detects a loss of HMI connection, shut certain outputs off after a certain time of day or if they haven't been toggled in a certain amount of time, monitor 4-20ma inputs like temperature and turn things on or off based on temperature, turn things off if they reach a safety temp threshold etc, all contained within the plc.

The type of control you mentioned with timers and things would be incredibly simple to do all on a single plc, and then build an HMI with advancedHMI and have it tell the plc what you want to do and have the plc intelligently carry the request out with safeties and checks etc instead of directly controlling single on/off relays with an HMI directly. If you can take the short time to make some sense of ladder logic I can guarantee you you'll be very happy you did and blown away at the possibilities : ) what you said of adding other CPU's later down the line with 4-20ma inputs and reading the temperature and even using that to alter what your inputs and outputs are doing would be very simple. Two months ago I had never heard of any of this and now I have a home automation system that monitors and controls my HVAC, heaters, air circulation, interlocks them so they can't run on top of each other, zones out all the climate control and allows individual control also based on time of day and outdoor climate, monitors smoke alarms and shuts off hvac and turns on specific lights and alarms if they go off, fires heaters near pipes prone to freezing when the outdoor temp gets too low, etc

You're kind of approaching an industrial automation/control project (from what it sounds like anyway) with a very non-industrial control approach which I think is what is throwing everyone off. As long as there's nothing critical being controlled then there's nothing inherently wrong with that, just expect to be very limited now and in the future with regards to what you can do and expand. However if it's controlling anything that can be remotely hazardous if operated incorrectly (like large ovens) then I highly recommend either bringing an automation/instrumentation guy in to oversee everything or spend a week or so learning ladder logic (it's really not that hard), build out the system and have someone look over it. Hope that helps I don't mean to discourage you heh

21
Open Discussion / Re: Controlling USB Relays via AdvancedHMI?
« on: November 04, 2014, 10:00:19 PM »
I'm sorry to pepper you with questions but as my post count indicates I am a complete newbie.

No problem! I'm somewhat of a newbie myself, I work in post production in the film industry and recently delved into the industrial automation world for a rather large home automation project (Click PLC based with AdvancedHMI on a wall-mounted touch screen).

If you check the previous link to the click expansion modules, you can get cards with 16 outputs (or 16 inputs) on one card. There are also combo cards that split it so you get 8 inputs and 8 outputs on one card. The Click supports up to 8 expansion cards, so that's 128 outputs on one PLC. The amazing thing with PLC's however, is a simple serial connection between them (eg over rs485 or rs232), the systems can now address each others inputs and outputs and a myriad of other things. So if you max out one plc with 128 outputs and need more, You can drop in another Click PLC with it's own expansion cards quite easily and have your hmi plugged into one plc be able to address and control the other plc as well, all on the same system.

Keep in mind PLC's were designed with this exact kind of application (high reliability, unpredictable scalability needs, etc) in mind. So things like adding another plc to the system is very easy and is done often.

EDIT: I just realized where you got the 8 output number, you're looking at the modules with built in high voltage relays. That can be convenient for controlling small numbers of things, but how it's done 99% of the time is using the typical low voltage solid state outputs (like on the normal output cards) to control external relays, either mechanical or solid state. This way you don't have to home run nearly a hundred different 120v lines all the way to your plc to be switched and then back again. You would usually run control wiring from the plc's low voltage output to whatever needs to be switched and have relays locally mounted there. This is how I'm controlling all the lighting in my house, I have a bank of solid state relays in the attic that intercepts all the lighting wiring locally, and a simple run of cat6 ethernet running from the relays back to the plc in the utility closet. (Cat6 turned out to be a great choice for a home project anyway, it's 8 full conductors (so control of 7 relays all sharing a common) and getting 200 feet for less than 20 dollars is incredibly easy on ebay. the 23 or 24awg is more than enough to carry the 50ma~ current required to switch a relay.)

Another thing to keep in mind is mechanical relays (like in the Click's AC output module) do have a lifespan due to moving parts and will eventually fail. So if you're using nothing but cards this means one input means replacing the whole card, however if you have external relays distributed around your building you can only replace what needs replacing. Better yet, if you use solid state relays, they will have a near-infinite lifetime assuming you use them at or below the rated current and do not let them get above their recommended max temp. If you want some suggestions on some cheap and reliable SSR's let me know.

Regarding Click and AdvancedHMI - With AdvancedHMI you use the ModbusRTU driver to talk to the click, which is just modbus over serial. The driver was pretty wonky a few months ago but I tested it as much as I could for Archie with a couple other Click users and he pretty quickly got it working perfectly. It's now plug and play and doing things like just turning things on and off is very easy. I'm currently using it with some on and off switches, temperature display and controls, and house power consumption monitoring displays. It was pretty easy to do now that the RTU driver is working well. No altering of the program was necessary which is good because I can't code for the life of me.

Hope that helps!

22
Open Discussion / Re: Controlling USB Relays via AdvancedHMI?
« on: November 04, 2014, 07:16:07 PM »
fohdeesha, I'm looking at the Click PLC. Only thing that would worry me is having one PLC to control everything, because if it goes down, everything will go down in our shop

How is that any different than using one relay board to control them? Except with just a board of relays (that is by it's own admission not intended for industrial/high reliability applications), you're also totally dependent on a (by industrial standards) super unreliable pc with a bunch of moving parts (fans) a non-realtime OS etc, so if that goes down your relay board is now useless. Versus a PLC designed from the ground up to run in these conditions. I know a few people that have Automation Direct PLC's (including Clicks) sitting in the bottom of sewer lift stations for up to 8 years cycling pumps and they haven't had to touch them since install.

If you're talking about using a PLC to replace ALL the non-automated controls in your entire building, the typical thing to do would be to spec a PLC in a slot chassis that allows the use of redundant CPU cards. Even then, it's quite rare for a plc to magically go down, they're essentially designed to run in awful conditions forever.

And you say the plc might be overkill, there's nothing wrong with overkill if it comes out cheaper and more reliable than barely getting by : )

23
Open Discussion / Re: Controlling USB Relays via AdvancedHMI?
« on: November 03, 2014, 03:57:06 PM »
For that price pick up a Click PLC. Even the analog model with two 4-20ma inputs and two 4-20ma outputs is cheaper than that simple board of relays. then you get a nice fully featured PLC that is easily controllable with AdvancedHMI via modbus RTU (this is what I'm doing for my home automation project). If you need more on/off outputs out of the click, just spend an additional 30 dollars ands get 16 more ins or outs with a input/output card. Then you have the advantage of having 4-20ma inputs so you can hook up things like temperature and pressure etc sensors, and you have a full plc so you can build in some logic/control that doesn't require constant human intervention via the HMI

PLC - http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Programmable_Controllers/CLICK_Series_PLCs_(Stackable_Micro_Brick)/PLC_Units/C0-02DD2-D

Expansion modules - http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Programmable_Controllers/CLICK_Series_PLCs_(Stackable_Micro_Brick)/DC_I-z-O

Can't recommend those things enough for small projects like this

24
Support Questions / Re: Upgrading existing project?
« on: October 22, 2014, 03:00:53 PM »
sweet!

25
Support Questions / Re: Upgrading existing project?
« on: October 22, 2014, 01:52:31 PM »
Thanks for the info. Sounds like it will be a good idea for me to wait to do the bulk of the work on this project until I'm on 3.80, any idea how soon it will be available?

26
Support Questions / Upgrading existing project?
« on: October 20, 2014, 07:33:11 PM »
When a new release of AdvancedHMI comes out, is there an easy way to "upgrade" an existing project? In the past I've only had really small projects so when a new version was released I just deleted it and started over in the new project of AdvancedHMI.

However now I have a pretty big project going, when 3.80 comes out is there a way to upgrade it without starting all over?

27
I am trying to use AdvancedHMI in C# 2012 express.can anyone suggest me how to use this VB solution in an C# project?

Did you seriously feel the need to spam the forum by pasting this post in 7 other totally unrelated threads? That's about the quickest way to ensure your question never gets answered

28
In previous versions the Modbus RTUCom had the option to  TreatDataAsHex, which when selected my timers and counters would display the correct values.   I can not find that option in the 370 version.  Is there another way to convert the data from hex to decimal so my displays with show the correct values?

Can you get those timer outputs into integer registers? if so then you could use this method to display decimal accuracy - http://advancedhmi.com/forum/index.php?topic=441.msg1660#msg1660

(apologies if that's not relevant at all, I haven't begun to play with timers yet. but if it's just a number output, floating point or real, you can multiply it and stick it in an integer register then add a decimal point with the meters

29
Support Questions / Re: Modbus RTU - KOYO PLC
« on: September 24, 2014, 05:10:27 PM »
The modbus driver in advancedHMI does not support floating point, so that's the problem you're running into. sounds like you've got everything else working though.

As a workaround what I've done to display floating point numbers, like the temperature DF value of 72.5, I multiple that register by 10 in the plc and put the result in an integer register (DS), so that integer register ends up being 725.

Then in AdvancedHMI with a digital panel meter I'll read that integer, and in the meter properties you can scroll down and find "decimal location", change it to 1 and it'll put a decimal one digit in so you end up displaying 72.5 : )

You can multiply by 100 or 1000 and move the decimal place accordingly for as much accuracy as you need. If you apply all of this but in reverse it should also work great for writing to DF registers







Hope that helps! I was kind of bummed about not being able to read floating point but then realized I can display all the decimal point accuracy I need by doing the above

30
Support Questions / Re: PLC addressing for 'dummies'.
« on: September 22, 2014, 05:53:56 PM »
The X-logic PLC's work great with advancedHMI, must be the Ethernet version, I have not tried the non Ethernet version with the TCP adaptor. I have an X-logic 22 running a sewage ejector in my nuclear bunker :)

advancedhmi now has a very nice bug free RTU driver, so no need for tcp adapters :)

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